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 Negate Stun > than raw defense?

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pabodie
Kelbi


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PostSubject: Negate Stun > than raw defense?   Tue Apr 24, 2012 7:46 pm

I am considering trading up my Jaggi+ (Negate Stun, Gourmand, Fire Res or Sleep +10 charmed depending on need, AUL). it is so awesome skillswise, but I keep getting WOMPED by Barioth+, and i want his armor.

So, as a stepping stone to Barioth killing, I was trying to decide:

a. Upgrade Jaggi+ to full strength, with a raw of 330 and KEEP NEGATE STUN (which I have come to think of as, essentially, a truckload of free defense since it majorly reduces the hits big monsters dish out when you are stunned), or...

b. Upgrade a low rank set to full strength (maybe Rathalos or Rathian, not sure yet) to get another 50-60 points of raw defense.

I want to spend time killing Barioths, and not farming Hvy Spheres until later, so this choice is a big one for me.

To me the crux seems to be that Negate Stun vs raw discussion I am having with myself, and now with you.

Looking for opinions on the value of Negate Stun versus raw defense and any other related advice.

Teach me something cool!

Thanks.
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Godzilla2195
Seltas


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PostSubject: Re: Negate Stun > than raw defense?   Tue Apr 24, 2012 9:30 pm

Try using a different weapon on him. Lances, in particular, make you almost indestructible with the right skills, plus they do ungodly damage when used properly. Great swords can shield too, and hammers slow down Barioth both with KO's and the fatigue they bring.
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Guest
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PostSubject: Re: Negate Stun > than raw defense?   Tue Apr 24, 2012 9:54 pm

Option A sounds good to me if you really cherish negate stun. It all depends on your style. My defense is 38O and I'm fine against barioth plus. Maybe try practicing on your own to learn how to anticipate when to dodge and attack. Also, bring flash bombs to flash it when it flies in the air.
Raw defense is better than negate stun in my opinion. Just dodge it's attacks and you'll be fine. I rarely get stunned because I do a barrel roll when I see the monster heading my direction. There is nothing wrong with overforging low rank armor, if there is a particular set with skills that you find to be assets, then over forging is your best bet.
If you need help fighting barioth plus I'm more than happy to.
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Quentin
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PostSubject: Re: Negate Stun > than raw defense?   Tue Apr 24, 2012 10:03 pm

I personally never had need of Jaggi+, I found that as long I could dodge the monster's attacks the skills afforded to me by low rank armors was better than just having more defense, all you have to do is always maintain max health, and dodge dodge dodge. If you can I would just overforge soem low rank armors and be done with it
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Lancin'Fool
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PostSubject: Re: Negate Stun > than raw defense?   Wed Apr 25, 2012 5:01 am

I'm curious what weapon you're using? Alot of the answer to your question really depends on you, your fighting style, your strengths and weaknesses, who and how many people you quest with.

If it were me, I would overforge some of my LR armors. Rathalos and Lagi for sure. I would hesitate to to others, because it seems the high rank ones have better skills, even if they are a pain to get.

Depending on what you have, you could overforge something and upgrade it only using the hard armor spheres, and try it out before you use the heavy ones. I'm pretty sure that would bring you sufficiently past the 330 mark, but it would be best to check. (I do this because I'm miserly with my Heavy armor spheres.

I used to depend heavily on negate stun, but as I found other skills I wanted, I kind of phased it out. I'm a fairly cautious hunter, though. I evade alot. I also tend to mostly duo quests with one other person, so it seems higher defense is in order. My husband is much less cautious (plus he can be greedy with the hits--if he's in a good position and getting lots of combos, he doesn't like to stop to evade the attack he knows is coming), he does tend to get stunned, and he likes the Jaggi+. Except now that he just got past the HR39 urgent quest, I think he'll overforge his Rathalos.

I don't know if this has any basis in reality, but it seems to me that the times I get stunned are the times I get hit twice in fairly quick succession, often when there's still recovery red on my health bar. Does anyone know the real rules about a monster stunning you?

Personally, I cannot imagine doing Barioth+ with Jaggi+ armor. I guess if it were me, I would try it with the OF Rathalos or something. OF Rathalos maxes at 78 per piece according to the wiki, and Rathian maxes at 74 per piece. If you use only hard and not heavy armor spheres, it looks like you'd have defense of 70 per piece? Check if that's right. My Rathian armor, upgraded to level 11 (no heavy armor spheres) gives me 311 defense before charms, talons or boosts. Rathalos would be at 350? I'm just surprised it's such a big jump. Am I reading something wrong? (It's very late and I'm very tired, and I suck with numbers. Yes, even just reading them. It's a thing.)

But Rathalos is worth overfoging anyway, for alot of people. The general consensus seems to be that the skills on the LR Rathalos armor are better than the HR armor.

Try it, gem out the defense down, keep your health up, evade alot, and the worst thing that can happen is that you go back to Jaggi+. Or you might be pleasantly surprised, and decide to use some of your heavies on the Rathalos afterall, for the extra defense advantage.

Oh, and last thing: doesn't the Barioth + give heavy armor spheres as quest rewards? Or is it the subquests? Either way, that would reduce your need to mine later, at least some, hopefully.

P.S. Sorry if I got kinda rambly. Like I said, it's late and I'm off to bed now.
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Quentin
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PostSubject: Re: Negate Stun > than raw defense?   Wed Apr 25, 2012 7:34 am

You can take lagiacrus armor, overforge it and gem in negate stun, that way you get both
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Leonhardt
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PostSubject: Re: Negate Stun > than raw defense?   Wed Apr 25, 2012 11:54 am

honestly, negate stun is a meh skill....if u kan learn to just twirl the joystick repeatedly, u kan get out of stun in about half a second...

you kan always get lagi for the extra slot to gem in awesome skills, peco set for evade +1, or hav patience and take the long way... jaggi to rathian to rathalos to barioth
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PostSubject: Re: Negate Stun > than raw defense?   Wed Apr 25, 2012 12:26 pm

also if u sahake the nunchuk it helps teh stun go away Yes by vort
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pabodie
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PostSubject: Lancin fool and thanks all   Wed Apr 25, 2012 12:37 pm

Wow Guys thanks for the replies. To answer Fool, I like my wyvern blade flare LS for Barioth. I do not use lances yet but I know with Jho coming soon I probably should practice. I like to hunt bigger monsters with 3-4 people and smaller alone or in a pair.

So far I overforged Ian and Los and gemmed negate stun on Ian, so it is working well so far. Up to 290 with room to grow.

Also as for stun, I think we are like the monsters, with a stun meter that fills up as we get hit, and then backs off as we evade, only we see white light flashes and hear a little wind chime sounds when hit in a way that effects the meter (?)

One big take away here, and I say this after watching some YouTube heroics, too, is that evading is a master able skill. Even for a blizzard of sharp objects like Barioth. Yes by vort
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Kanade
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PostSubject: Re: Negate Stun > than raw defense?   Thu Apr 26, 2012 2:36 am

go with defense cuz you shouldn't be getting hit that consistently to be stunned that much to make negate stun so valuable, especially if you're learning to evade

if you don't mind getting hit a lot then keep the negate stun to help out
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Ugthorf
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PostSubject: Re: Negate Stun > than raw defense?   Thu Apr 26, 2012 1:04 pm

Ideally since you can roll the uroktor, if you want to have negate stun you should go for a +10 OO tali. That way you only need to consume 1 gem slot on your actual armor.
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Chips
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PostSubject: Re: Negate Stun > than raw defense?   Thu Apr 26, 2012 1:50 pm

@Ugthorf wrote:
Ideally since you can roll the uroktor, if you want to have negate stun you should go for a +10 OO tali. That way you only need to consume 1 gem slot on your actual armor.

That would be ideal, but it wouldn't be what its worth for the amount of time you would need to get it. It would take forever to obtain that specific talisman, unless you're extremely lucky.
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GobulHunterJames
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PostSubject: Re: Negate Stun > than raw defense?   Fri Apr 27, 2012 5:47 am

Since i haven't seen anyone mention it yet, having Negate Stun actually makes Thunderblight useless since Thunderblight makes you get stunned easier. Just a little note in case you get hit by electric attacks often. (Bloody Lagiacrus electric field...)
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PostSubject: Re: Negate Stun > than raw defense?   Today at 1:11 am

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