SnS Discussion Thread

Because Master Onion wouldn't object! Simply discuss about the Sword and Shield... Also, no negative things about it like "SnS is sooo bad! Go Lance dawg!" Okay?

Isnt it funny that the shield doesnt bounce when you hit a monsters face (Gaan,agna), yet your sword does?
The shield is tiny after all...
I never did understand the logic in this game.

Sapphire wrote:

Isnt it funny that the shield doesnt bounce when you hit a monsters face (Gaan,agna), yet your sword does?
The shield is tiny after all...
I never did understand the logic in this game.

The game decides when it should conform to reality and when it should be absurd. Part of the charm, if you ask me.

I've only played with one SnS user that made any lasting impression on me. Their name was Angel, and they still get on every now and then. Anyway, Angel was primarily concerned with aiding the team as we farmed stout horns. He kept all of us in good health, so much so that we never needed to heal ourselves. He also managed sonic bombs, flashes, and traps, making the Diablos such a push-over, that at the end of the quest, every one agreed that Angel was the hero of the team. If I ever use SnS's, that's how I try to play: Put the team before damage.

Obviously, for me, the strength of the Sword and Shield is in it's ability to quickly use items.

Godzilla2195 wrote:

Obviously, for me, the strength of the Sword and Shield is in it's ability to quickly use items.

And its movability, but the usage of items is its main strength.
Using 4 traps, 10 sonics, 10 flashs, and maybe a status weapon on Diablos makes it way easier, along with party-heal abilities/items. Hell, sns could work on jho well if it's ala sns. However, I didn't really tried this much, yet. I did see it in a video. Pretty much, if you suck and can't kill a monster, just go sns and bring a bunch of materials of traps, pots, and crap. It'll work 24/7; the only problem is getting the supplies. I like sns support more than support gunner; however, gunners usually aren't in the way and sometimes sns supports attack very little, but at least they help. It's probably the easiest weapon to play in MH Tri 3. All the classes are good, but I still personally dislike gunner. Clust spamming does tons of damage, but where's the fun?

Ala SnS is the best dragon SnS...the raw power does matter.

SnS, to me, is a medic with high potential in combos of both items and attacks. When a team is at a disadvantage, SnS Support can reverse it in seconds. SnS is not a bad weapon to learn first, but it shouldn't be a main weapon imo because it lacks burst damage. GS and Hammer have high burst damage.

For example, a rocket launcher has high burst damage, but machine guns have higher dps in killing people. It's honestly not the best example.

Here's another example. In the game LOL, an ap carry has high burst damage, but an ad carry has high dps damage.

The role of Support SnS can be overwhelming or very fast-pace, which is why I rather support gunner because it's more relaxing. Also, it's easier to blame it on the blademasters as gunner, trololol. The role of Support SnS isn't always as easy as it seems on paper.

Also, Support SnS is cheaper than Support gunner.

https://mhwiki.forumotion.net/t8534p15-bestworst-weapons-for-each-monster
SnS is my number 1 on Diablos!

Sapphire wrote:

Isnt it funny that the shield doesnt bounce when you hit a monsters face (Gaan,agna), yet your sword does?
The shield is tiny after all...
I never did understand the logic in this game.

The shield is that heavy! ;)
It probably has more to do with surface area and using more power/force with shield attacks. Shield attacks actually transfer body weight into force, if you see how the avatar moves its body and limbs. However, it's a video game, so anything can happen for petty reasons. Shield is OP! Captain America style!

Honestly, MH Tri 3 has a lot of rational reasons behind the unrealistic concepts in comparison to most games (disregarding sport games). A lot of things makes sense to me in MH than other games like Pac Man. Fantasies are born from reality (not literally).

I have to sharpen my great sword...hey, we do that with kitchen knives, too!
What's funny to me is when I cook meat in MH Tri 3, so funny!

I do have to agree that the Sword and Shield works well as a support melee, but, with right setups can hold it's own fairly well. Though, it does lack the burst damage or overall crazy dps from weapons like GS and Lance, it does however in my opinion, possess a rather stylish way of how it handle's itself in attacks and movements.

Stabster wrote:

Godzilla2195 wrote:

Obviously, for me, the strength of the Sword and Shield is in it's ability to quickly use items.

Ala SnS is the best dragon SnS...the raw power does matter.

If raw power mattered that much, then the jhen sns would come out on top.

However, it's not just about element either. If it was, then divine exodus would be on top. Which is obviously not the case.
I'm not saying that other snses are better than ala star, I'm just saying its not just about raw.

I believe sns gets it damage 60% from its raw and 40% from its element.

So you are correct; however, it is not entirely dependent on raw but rather, on both. THAT's Why its the best; it has a decent balance of both.

That and its sharpness.

Just saiyan. :hiccc:

I like how with SnS' you have to plan ahead for the monster you are going to fight. It gives it an element of strategy that other weapons just don't have in my opinion.

Ultimate Jaggi wrote:

Stabster wrote:

Godzilla2195 wrote:

Obviously, for me, the strength of the Sword and Shield is in it's ability to quickly use items.

Ala SnS is the best dragon SnS...the raw power does matter.

If raw power mattered that much, then the jhen sns would come out on top.

However, it's not just about element either. If it was, then divine exodus would be on top. Which is obviously not the case.
I'm not saying that other snses are better than ala star, I'm just saying its not just about raw.

I believe sns gets it damage 60% from its raw and 40% from its element.

So you are correct; however, it is not entirely dependent on raw but rather, on both. THAT's Why its the best; it has a decent balance of both.

That and its sharpness.

Just saiyan. :hiccc:

Jhen SnS loses because Ala SnS has more "raw" damage x:

because... purple sharpness is practically an AUL (ever better)

So yea that's why Ala SnS > Jhen SnS

Also the fact that Ala SnS even has added dragon element :3

Raw power does matter, but you should always go for monster elemental weakness with SnS.

Basically Ala wins over all dragon SnS due to its raw and sharpness.

MasterOnion wrote:

I like how with SnS' you have to plan ahead for the monster you are going to fight. It gives it an element of strategy that other weapons just don't have in my opinion.

That, that right there is one of the top 3 reasons why I love using the SnS. Besides bowguns (I don't clust spam, only use them if I got them, rather use my other, more fun shots) there is a element of planning that is needed to use that weapon. Lances and long swords have crazy dps that almost makes it so element doesn't matter sometimes. Great Swords have that lv 3 charge, Hammers that super pound, switch axes that sword mode... see the point?

Ken Kurobasa wrote:

MasterOnion wrote:

I like how with SnS' you have to plan ahead for the monster you are going to fight. It gives it an element of strategy that other weapons just don't have in my opinion.

That, that right there is one of the top 3 reasons why I love using the SnS. Besides bowguns (I don't clust spam, only use them if I got them, rather use my other, more fun shots) there is a element of planning that is needed to use that weapon. Lances and long swords have crazy dps that almost makes it so element doesn't matter sometimes. Great Swords have that lv 3 charge, Hammers that super pound, switch axes that sword mode... see the point?

I disagree on the LS, SA and Lance part. During on the way to HR51 element does matter a bit. Of course at endgame, they won't matter much. They are not as dependent as SnS is on element, however for non-endgame gear you'd want elemental match up too for those weapons.

Well I was thinking endgame, sorry I didn't think about before endgame XD. Anyhow, I do feel there are some monsters that are just more fun to face down with the sword and shield than other weapons. My example is barioth because to me, it is a mirror match of speed.

Chips wrote:

Ultimate Jaggi wrote:

Stabster wrote:

Godzilla2195 wrote:

Obviously, for me, the strength of the Sword and Shield is in it's ability to quickly use items.

Ala SnS is the best dragon SnS...the raw power does matter.

If raw power mattered that much, then the jhen sns would come out on top.

However, it's not just about element either. If it was, then divine exodus would be on top. Which is obviously not the case.
I'm not saying that other snses are better than ala star, I'm just saying its not just about raw.

I believe sns gets it damage 60% from its raw and 40% from its element.

So you are correct; however, it is not entirely dependent on raw but rather, on both. THAT's Why its the best; it has a decent balance of both.

That and its sharpness.

Just saiyan. :hiccc:

Jhen SnS loses because Ala SnS has more "raw" damage x:

because... purple sharpness is practically an AUL (ever better)

So yea that's why Ala SnS > Jhen SnS

Also the fact that Ala SnS even has added dragon element :3

Raw power does matter, but you should always go for monster elemental weakness with SnS.

Basically Ala wins over all dragon SnS due to its raw and sharpness.

I know all o' dis.

But "technically" he wasn't including sharpness when he said that. However, you're right.

I still think calm sands looks pretty cool on my back :X

I was intending to appeal to the myth of Eternal Hate being the best dragon SnS based on its high dragon element. Last time I played, people were using Eternal Hate on jhen when they had a fully upgraded ala sns at bank. /no/ The thing is, absolute definitions are usually flawed. When the pros say that SnS scales from element damage, they don't mean completely/entirely. I see these problems of bias assumptions a lot in games and it can be frustrating.

Y'all are correct for the sake of technicality and math. I argued with newbs a lot in games and in doing so is moronic. Some main reasons of why I argue is to find truth and a deeper meaning, but also to understand why I'm wrong or correct. Politicians don't argue for these purposes, except maybe truth. However, I do argue for entertainment by mistake, sometimes.

Ultimate Jaggi wrote:

Stabster wrote:

Godzilla2195 wrote:

Obviously, for me, the strength of the Sword and Shield is in it's ability to quickly use items.

Ala SnS is the best dragon SnS...the raw power does matter.

If raw power mattered that much, then the jhen sns would come out on top.

Wat

To clear up some misconceptions and this applies to all weapons

Purple sharpness is not like AUL, its much better there's no comparison; from blue to white is where the boost most resembles AUL and the sharpness boost will win slightly in raw and 100% in elemental (since AUL has no affects on element)

Element will only beat out on Raw if you aren't hitting the weakest point of the monster, since the value from element on all slashes are constant, or if some monsters take high elemental but low raw on some parts (Diablos horns will break faster with elemental damage, Uragaan's chin as well)

SnS have low percents for each individual slash on the raw that's why its considered an elemental weapon, but the raw will still count for most of it's damage on most monster hitzones

Ken Kurobasa wrote:

MasterOnion wrote:

I like how with SnS' you have to plan ahead for the monster you are going to fight. It gives it an element of strategy that other weapons just don't have in my opinion.

That, that right there is one of the top 3 reasons why I love using the SnS. Besides bowguns (I don't clust spam, only use them if I got them, rather use my other, more fun shots) there is a element of planning that is needed to use that weapon. Lances and long swords have crazy dps that almost makes it so element doesn't matter sometimes. Great Swords have that lv 3 charge, Hammers that super pound, switch axes that sword mode... see the point?

I rather go with axe mode than sword mode I rather work with the raw damage from axe mode than the element boost of sword mode

use a Power phial axe then o,O

I love Sword and Shield, I love how active you have to be to use it; jumping around and what not. It's a very exciting way to play the game. Been using it since I started, and I've tried other weapons but....it's just not the same.

I think my favorite SnS would have to be Wagga Wagga...though I have refrained from using it because it doesn't look as cool with my new outfit like Calm Sands does. Favorite monsters are Barroth, Barioth, and Jho. Barioth is especially fun because it's speed against speed. Another thing to mention is that it's a great solo weapon. You have easy accessibility to items that change the tide of battle. Defense, attack, mobility...in my opinion it's the perfect weapon.

PeaceofBert wrote:

I love Sword and Shield, I love how active you have to be to use it; jumping around and what not. It's a very exciting way to play the game. Been using it since I started, and I've tried other weapons but....it's just not the same.

I think my favorite SnS would have to be Wagga Wagga...though I have refrained from using it because it doesn't look as cool with my new outfit like Calm Sands does. Favorite monsters are Barroth, Barioth, and Jho. Barioth is especially fun because it's speed against speed. Another thing to mention is that it's a great solo weapon. You have easy accessibility to items that change the tide of battle. Defense, attack, mobility...in my opinion it's the perfect weapon.

Ahh...
Wagga wagga and calm sands...
The most fun to use, yet the least practical or powerful?

Ultimate Jaggi wrote:

Ahh...
Wagga wagga and calm sands...
The most fun to use, yet the least practical or powerful?

Yeah I hear that a lot. I don't mind, but I believe that the most powerful/practical weapon/armor is the one your most comfortable with. And among SnS there are differences. It just feels different...Toxic Fang feels different than using Wagga Wagga and Wagga Wagga feels different than Calm Sands.

Besides that, how much power do you really need? I mean...the only monsters I haven't taken down by myself are Jhen, Ala, and Jho...and that's possibly only because I haven't tried. I've even done dual monster quests...
Any more power and I'd be afraid of Wagga Wagga /scar/

About the only time I find myself reaching for an SnS is when I feel like stating with a melee weapon.Usually using para so that I can try and stun once it's been para'd,for that extended immobility. xD

Ultimate Jaggi wrote:

Ahh...
Wagga wagga and calm sands...
The most fun to use, yet the least practical or powerful?

The deadliest SnS is hands-down without question the Deadly Knife.

Chips wrote:

Ultimate Jaggi wrote:

Ahh...
Wagga wagga and calm sands...
The most fun to use, yet the least practical or powerful?

The deadliest SnS is hands-down without question the Deadly Knife.

So deadly it doesnt even need status/elemental damage :l

Sapphire wrote:

Chips wrote:

Ultimate Jaggi wrote:

Ahh...
Wagga wagga and calm sands...
The most fun to use, yet the least practical or powerful?

The deadliest SnS is hands-down without question the Deadly Knife.

So deadly it doesnt even need status/elemental damage :l

It's rank 3 with BLUE Sharpness. It's that badass.

I agree...I discovered Deadly Knife for the first time in this playthrough...and yeah I was surprised at how powerful it was and how early you can get it. If I ever start over again I'm setting my sights on it.