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| How do Statuses work | |
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DanielisAwesome52 Cephalos
Thank you Points : 4
Monster Hunter Information 3DS friends code: Primary MH Title: Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate WiiU Country of Origin (for connection Speed use): USA
| Subject: How do Statuses work Wed Feb 26, 2014 12:12 am | |
| I know how the tolerance system works, but what I want to know is how does the game determine when an attack does status damage or not.
not every strike has the visual effect when it hits so how does it figure that.
Me and a friend have been somewhat testing it and we notice (at least between the three paralysis DB) that the lower values seem to inflict more often.
A few times against the double Jaggi 3* quest we each take a jaggi with similiar armor skills (ie not atk or status bonuses) it appears the lower ones like Gobul and green narga afflict more often, as in their visuals appear more, and the shakalakas appear less, they end up paralyzing the same number of times,
I have seen though that because of the shakas low attack they end up doing a third para before jaggi dies. but considering the gobul blades and green narga tend to finish their jaggi first i think its merely a health thing rather than tolerance | |
| | | GobulHunterJames Kecha Wacha
Thank you Points : 1
Monster Hunter Information 3DS friends code: Primary MH Title: Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate WiiU Country of Origin (for connection Speed use): UK
| Subject: Re: How do Statuses work Wed Feb 26, 2014 6:23 am | |
| Status values are only added when the status animation is shown from a strike, I'm not sure how the exact value is calculated but I know that like element, it isn't changed in any ways by the type of attack. (A Greatsword with 300 Para's full-charge attack will give off the same para value as a SnS with 300 Para's slice)
I don't know what determines which attack becomes status but I guess it's a percentage much like affinity which doesn't change based on weapon.
For a full test you'd have to count a number of hits you do and how many times it does the effect and then count the same number of hits from a shaka and count how many hits does the effect.
Because of the percentage based effect, it's easily possible that one run your weapons may deal paralysis more often than another.
Be aware that with dual blades they usually have a lower status value than other weapons due to their rapid hits, since as I stated before, value is the same per hit regardless of weapon or attack, which could be a reason why you see more Paralysis hits with Dual blades than the Shakalakas do. | |
| | | DanielisAwesome52 Cephalos
Thank you Points : 4
Monster Hunter Information 3DS friends code: Primary MH Title: Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate WiiU Country of Origin (for connection Speed use): USA
| Subject: Re: How do Statuses work Wed Feb 26, 2014 6:26 am | |
| I meant the shakalaka DBs not actually ChaCha and Maya, they have 300 or so Para compared to 190 and 110 on gobul or green narga | |
| | | Sephastus Tigrex
Thank you Points : 32
Monster Hunter Information 3DS friends code: Primary MH Title: Monster Hunter Generations Country of Origin (for connection Speed use): USA
| Subject: Re: How do Statuses work Thu Feb 27, 2014 11:45 am | |
| Status "visuals" work the same as when a monster twitches. Meaning, it will only show up when its past a certain threshold.
Example (Not real numbers) - Diablos Initial poison limit. - 100. With a 2 point decrease every second Poison animation every 20 Single sword hit adds 5 Roughly, every 4th to 5th hit, will trigger the animation, and when the 100 points are breached, the Diablos gets poisoned and the counter gets reset to the next limit, which is around 150 for all subsequent poisons.
If you get to inflict 150 poison again before the first poison is over, it will stack another poison on top of the one already in progress.
Remember, the number on the weapon is NOT what is getting applied to the monster. Each weapon has its own application rate... so a GS unsheathed level 3 charged hit with Critical draw will apply close to 3x the shown status (which will mean you will almost always see an application animation due to hitting the "flinch" thresh-hold of status on the monster.), while a single strike of a sword & shield, will only apply 15% of what you see on the blade, which would mean you need several strikes before you see an application.
Notable exceptions: since the status count decreases every set amount of time, it is possible for you to see multiple "applications" in a row, when using a fast attack, low status weapon, since the status count could jump in between the thresholds. EX. Your hit took the count from 16-20, hitting the threshold, and triggering the animation, but at the same time, the counter went down by one tic, bringing it down to 17, and your subsequent hit brought it up to 21, triggering another animation. At this point you dodge, and the timer makes the status tick down one more time, and the mnster is at 18, and you strike again, brining it back up through the animation. Your next 5 consecutive hits, show no animation, but that doesn't mean it didn't apply anything, and then you will notice again, that you apply something at the 6th hit, and maybe even the 7th, due to the same deterioration.
Hope that wasn't to confusing to follow. | |
| | | DanielisAwesome52 Cephalos
Thank you Points : 4
Monster Hunter Information 3DS friends code: Primary MH Title: Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate WiiU Country of Origin (for connection Speed use): USA
| Subject: Re: How do Statuses work Fri Feb 28, 2014 2:28 am | |
| That all makes sense, but now I want to know what each weapon types modifiers are like how of the visible number of the status are you doing. A formula would be great but I can't find anything like it.
I know Kiranico.com has a few of the numbers for some monsters tolerances but I want to know how those numbers relate to the values on weapons and how to use the formulas to manipulate the afflictions. | |
| | | Sephastus Tigrex
Thank you Points : 32
Monster Hunter Information 3DS friends code: Primary MH Title: Monster Hunter Generations Country of Origin (for connection Speed use): USA
| Subject: Re: How do Statuses work Fri Feb 28, 2014 12:39 pm | |
| You and me both Daniel! I would love to manipulate afflictions lol But before you go too crazy, how will that information actually change your gameplay? Will you swing more or less often depending on how close the monster is to getting an affliction? If your answer is, "I want to know anyways"... - Spoiler:
(STATUS x SHARP x STATUSRES x Var) / 10 = Total Status
Status = Number visible on weapon
Sharpness Purple: 1.20 White: 1.125 Blue: 1.0625 Green: 1.0 Yellow: 0.75 Orange: 0.50 Red: 0.25
StatusRes: How weak the monster is to the particular status. Most are at 0.30
Var: Stands for Variable, and only applies to the Greatsword Charges. It is always a 1 unless you are using a Greatsword, in which case:
Charge 1: 1.5 Charge 2: 2.0 Full Charge: 3.0 Failed Charge: 2.0
So, let's say you have Secta Du, a SS which has 260 Paralysis and Blue sharpness:
(STATUS(260) x SHARP(Blue 1.0625) x STATUSRES (0.30) x Var (1)) / 10 = Total Status (8.285)
So, rounded down, Every hit from the Secta Du will apply 8 points of Paralysis to the monster.
You will also notice that the speed or type of hit doesn't affect the outcome... so if you want to apply an ailment, fast strikes are way better than powerful strikes.
In addition to this, like I said in my prior post, the monsters resistance increases every time you successfully cause a status ailment, and each monsters' Tolerance numbers are different.
Example: Diablos - 200 Initial Tolerance to poison, This will increase by 50 each time poison is applied, to a maximum of 400. His recovery is also at 10 every 5 seconds. So, you could take him all the way to 199, but if you stop attacking, or it switches zones, or something else where you can't apply poison to it, it will be back at 0 in less than 2 minutes.
Credit where it is due - Brian VanWulfen Did the legwork to figure out the formulas and so on.
Hope that helps. But please remember to have fun and don't make this too much a game of Min/Maxing. | |
| | | DanielisAwesome52 Cephalos
Thank you Points : 4
Monster Hunter Information 3DS friends code: Primary MH Title: Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate WiiU Country of Origin (for connection Speed use): USA
| Subject: Re: How do Statuses work Fri Feb 28, 2014 3:26 pm | |
| The information doesnt exactly change my method of gameplay, but it does shed some light on why certain methods work better. For example when I use the Kelbi bow I utilized all three status coatings (not so much exhaust since I find it difficult to KO with a bow, and I never really see exhaust when using it either (usually due to the cheapness of rage modes) but it does show me why Focus and Load Up make applying level 4 Rapid 4 shots is the best way to afflict a status, just now I realize I have to be as quick as possible when hitting, cause any waiting around could waste my coatings.
I'm still unsure on the pros and cons of high status low attack DBs vs low status high attack like the difference between the Chum-Chum Scarecrows and the Midnight Black Wings.
How much does that face value affect my attacks on quick weps like DBs, would I get more paralysis on the Shakas even if it didnt take them so long to deal damage? Or is it better to just use the Blackwings since they would get virtually similiar paralysis? Or would the Higher Status Value be necessary for monsters resistant to Para? | |
| | | Sephastus Tigrex
Thank you Points : 32
Monster Hunter Information 3DS friends code: Primary MH Title: Monster Hunter Generations Country of Origin (for connection Speed use): USA
| Subject: Re: How do Statuses work Fri Feb 28, 2014 5:25 pm | |
| I think what weapon you go with will depend on if you are in a group or not, and whether or not the monster has thick skin. Here is the math: - Spoiler:
(STATUS x SHARP x STATUSRES x Var) / 10 = Total Status
Chum Chum Scarecrows - 196 Attack, 250 paralysis. Blue Sharpness Midnight Black Wings - 308 Attack, 110 Paralysis (Awakened) White Sharpness
Chum Chum Scarecrows = 7 Paralysis Per hit (250x1.0625x0.30)/10 = 7.96875 Sharpness + 1 (White) = 8 Paralysis per hit (250x1.0625x0.30)/10 = 8.4375 Midnight Black Wings = 3 Paralysis per hit (110x1.125x0.30)/10 = 3.7125 Sharpness +1 (Purple) = 3 Paralysis per hit (110x1.2x0.30)/10 = 3.96
So far, the Chum Chum Scarecrows are 2 1/2 times better at paralyzing a monster... which is great... however, there are many other things that have to factor into the hunt. The amount of times you bounce off the monster, whether or not you are in a group, and, of course, damage output.
The Midnight Black wings will take twice as long to paralyze as the Chum Chums, as long as the weapons do not bounce off, but they more than make up for this in raw damage. So ultimately the decision is yours on what you want to trade off. Remember, every subsequent paralysis will be harder to bring about, so, in a group, they might want more paralysis time, while for solo, you might want to not let the fight drag on. | |
| | | DanielisAwesome52 Cephalos
Thank you Points : 4
Monster Hunter Information 3DS friends code: Primary MH Title: Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate WiiU Country of Origin (for connection Speed use): USA
| Subject: Re: How do Statuses work Fri Feb 28, 2014 5:28 pm | |
| aright that makes sense, i assume it works the same relatively to other wep types as well.
as in long swords and SnS, low value makes up in damage, etc. | |
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